#565: Michael Schur, Creator of “The Good Place” — How SNL Trains Writers, His TV University at “The Office,” Lessons from Lorne Michaels, Wisdom from David Foster Wallace, and Exploring Moral Philosophy with “How to Be Perfect”

Brought to you by LMNT electrolyte supplement, Helix Sleep premium mattresses, and LinkedIn Jobs recruitment platform with 770M+ users. Michael Schur (@KenTremendous) created the critically acclaimed NBC comedy The Good Place and co-created Parks and Recreation, Brooklyn Nine-Nine, and the Peacock series Rutherford Falls. He is also an executive producer on HBO Max’s Hacks and Netflix’s Master of None. Prior to “Parks,” Michael spent four years as a writer-producer on the Emmy Award-winning NBC hit The Office. His first TV writing job was at Saturday Night Live, where he spent seven seasons, including three as the producer of “Weekend Update” with Tina Fey and Jimmy Fallon. Michael’s new book is How to Be Perfect: The Correct Answer to Every Moral Question. Please enjoy! This episode is brought to you by Helix Sleep! Helix was selected as the #1 overall mattress of 2020 by GQ magazine, Wired, Apartment Therapy, and many others. With Helix, there’s a specific mattress to meet each and every body’s unique comfort needs. Just take their quiz—only two minutes to complete—that matches your body type and sleep preferences to the perfect mattress for you. They have a 10-year warranty, and you get to try it out for a hundred nights, risk free. They’ll even pick it up from you if you don’t love it. And now, to my dear listeners, Helix is offering up to 200 dollars off all mattress orders plus two free pillows at HelixSleep.com/Tim. * This episode is also brought to you by LMNT! What is LMNT? It’s a delicious, sugar-free electrolyte drink mix. I’ve stocked up on boxes and boxes of this and usually use it 1–2 times per day. LMNT is formulated to help anyone with their electrolyte needs and perfectly suited to folks following a keto, low-carb, or Paleo diet. If you are on a low-carb diet or fasting, electrolytes play a key role in relieving hunger, cramps, headaches, tiredness, and dizziness. LMNT came up with a very special offer for you, my dear listeners. For a limited time, you can claim a free LMNT Sample Pack—you only cover the cost of shipping. For US customers, this means you can receive an 8-count sample pack for only $5. Simply go to DrinkLMNT.com/Tim to claim your free 8-count sample pack. * This episode is also brought to you by LinkedIn Jobs. Whether you are looking to hire now for a critical role or thinking about needs that you may have in the future, LinkedIn Jobs can help. LinkedIn screens candidates for the hard and soft skills you’re looking for and puts your job in front of candidates looking for job opportunities that match what you have to offer. Using LinkedIn’s active community of more than 770 million professionals worldwide, LinkedIn Jobs can help you find and hire the right person faster. When your business is ready to make that next hire, find the right person with LinkedIn Jobs. And now, you can post a job for free. Just visit LinkedIn.com/Tim. * How did Michael get involved with The Harvard Lampoon, and what did the audition process look like? How was the writing process different during his time there than it might be in a comparable publication today? [05:58] How performing live comedy is like Roman gladiator combat, and what Michael learned during his seven seasons as a writer for Saturday Night Live. [12:53] Michael shares his David Foster Wallace story, and his own thoughts about adapting Infinite Jest into a miniseries. [20:03] Why did Michael decide to leave SNL and continue his career in Los Angeles? How did he wind up writing for the US adaptation of The Office in spite of being unsure that such an adaptation was even a good idea? [31:10] Why does Michael consider the opportunity to work with The Office showrunner Greg Daniels “the greatest stroke of good fortune” that’s ever befallen him? What did he learn from the experience that SNL didn’t teach him? [39:12] What is the F = ma of sitcom writing, and how did this play into character development on The Office? [44:35] If Michael’s house were burning down and he only had time to rescue five things, what would they be? [53:20] How did Michael become a rare book collector? [57:45] Where did Michael’s alter ego of Ken Tremendous (and Fremulon, his equally fictitious place of employment) originate? [1:01:13] With television networks often skittish about deviating from proven formulas, how did a show as unique as The Good Place come about? [1:08:10] How the seed of the idea that became The Good Place was planted by an outrageous car repair bill. [1:16:15] Michael once joked that he would love How to Be Perfect to do for moral philosophy what A Brief History of Time did for astrophysics. If that’s a tall order, what would he consider an acceptable takeaway for its readers? [1:27:58] What qualifies the legitimacy of a philosopher? Is it when they can get people to actually read (and understand) their work? [1:32:58] If Michael could have a drink or dinner with any philosopher, living or dead, who would he choose? [1:39:53] What two philosophers would Michael choose to have on speed dial for his own personal instruction? [1:43:36] What comics in my own collection do I most treasure? What kind of D&D characters did I tend to play in my youth? [1:49:11] Michael’s most worthwhile failures (and one recurring failure that still gives him nightmares). [1:51:17] Michael is sorry if his billboard offends you. [2:01:28] Who are Todd May and Pamela Hieronymi, and how did they become The Good Place writers’ room emergency contacts? [2:06:00] Why Michael encourages us all to get educated about ethics by any means comfortable (and if that includes reading How to Be Perfect, so be it) where the proceeds of book sales will be directed, and other parting thoughts. [2:10:12] * For show notes and past guests, please visit tim.blog/podcast. Sign up for Tim’s email newsletter (“5-Bullet Friday”) at tim.blog/friday. For transcripts of episodes, go to tim.blog/transcripts. Discover Tim’s books: tim.blog/books. 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