330: Deconstructing The Art & Science Of Interviewing With Jay Acunzo

The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk #330: Deconstructing The Art & Science Of Interviewing With Jay Acunzo Full show notes can be found at www.LearningLeader.com This is a special bonus episode focusing on deconstructing the art and science of interviewing.  You will hear learning happening in real time.  Jay Acunzo and I go a meta-level to better understand how to better improve our conversation ability, how to be better in an interview.  "Interviewing is a skill that enhances your life in a pleasant and unexpected way."  This is focused on how you can ask better questions, be more interesting and more interested, and become a better conversationalist. Notes:  The meta level of deconstructing the process of making the work is rare... "I experience the most flow when it's quiet, nitty-gritty work.  Those minute are profoundly rewarding for me." What makes a great interview? An open loop -- Start telling the story, but wait to close the loop until later to build intrigue... The difference between a narrative style show and an interview getting to know someone: A story is three parts - The intent of the story: The "Joseph Campbell Heroes Journey" 1) Status Quo 2) Conflict 3) Resolution Bucket of questions: "Tell me about X..." "How did it make you feel?" The analysis and the reflection Change your mindset: "You're not an interviewer, you're a dance partner." "The only thing that matters is that you lead.  Everything else is little subtle moves to get people to go to where you want to go." "It's not a constant march forward. Instead, think of it like a dance. There are some steps back, steps forward, steps to the side — all packaged together in one coherent experience, with lots of zig-zagging and subtle steps inside those boundaries." Open ended questions: “Tell me about X” gets you story details, while “how did it feel when” gets you key moments of reflection and analysis. Both are crucial. Clip #1 -- JJ Redick  He says “great question” — what would make someone interviewed as often as a pro athlete say that? How to prep for an interview for someone who is interviewed all the time? Built a basic rapport leading up to the interview -- Discussed sports, restaurants, podcasting, interviewing.  Developed a "friend" level of communication Create an environment where the guest wants it to be a great show Good follow up questions: Ask for an example... Asking, "How did that make you feel?" "What's your process?" --> Then be a deep, thoughtful listener to ask a follow up. Stay on the same level with your dance partner - Don't be a guest "worshiper" When following up, there are a few things you can do: 1) Distill 2) Disagree 3) Ask the next question... During an interview, the best question you can ask: "How did that make you feel?" It enables them to get in an emotional lane (away from canned responses) Testing the levels on the microphone -- Don't waste that opportunity.  Engineer the guest, the human -- You need them to feel like we're hanging out and excited about the interview.  Make it fun.  What to ask instead: "I'm going to check your levels, do you have any pets at home?" "What would be your last meal on earth?" -- It helps people break out of their corporate drone mode.  The question is about the person, on a human plane. Create a safe space for them to share their truth. "I'm not a journalist, I'm a conversationalist." Clip #2 -- Adam Savage How did he get on the show? Working with a PR firm to book a guest -- A great PR person like Brent Underwood only recommends guests that are a good fit for the show. Ask questions that you are genuinely curious about -- I am curious about someone's process and it's always led me to a useful follow up... The issue is sometimes a "process" oriented question is the guest can answer with a generality... How to wiggle out of that? Look at the acknowledgement section of their book to get ideas for important people/events in their life to ask about... Mental Heuristics: Tell me about, 30,000 feet, go to a specific example... The third question is "Putting them in a box:" -- " From Jay: Heuristics to tell great AUDIO stories: Tell me about... How did you feel when (or, how did that feel?) Can you give me an example? (Superlatives) Best, worst, funniest, scariest, hardest, least certain, favorite, etc... (Dig for emotional moments) Clip #3 -- Brian Koppelman How to handle nerves -- Work to get settled in.  Get through the initial conversation point... Give people a genuine compliment for why you like their work -- Tell people why their work helps you Hidden Gems: Interplay between your intent for the work and your framework for it: "My goal is to engineer an outcome, but I have an intent I don't want to become The Bachelor in Paradise." Have self and situational awareness.  We carry with us good intent to serve the audience.  Don't let the framework or engineering supersede the original intent. The two types of interviews: 1) The person, their story... 2) Their content The best conversations are able to weave both together and smoothly bounce back and forth Learn about the person AND learn about the topic that he has mastered -- Master that dance between both -- I need to give you something that is going to make you better. Use the "Get To Know You Document" Why joining The Learning Leader Circle is a good idea